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May 25th, 2019, 9:17am 
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   Can't save Real Singer
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harleygnuya
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  harleygnuya   harleygnuya


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Can't save Real Singer  
« on: Mar 23rd, 2019, 8:38pm »
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I'm trying to record myself to create a Real Singer, but when I get done recording my phonemes, close Real Singer, add my new voice to the list, when I press on the Try button, no sound is played.  Likewise, when I exit the Virtual Singer dialog box, etc., then open a song file, assign my new voice to the singer and play the song, no sound comes out.  If I switch to a different voice it plays just fine.  
 
I have tried repeatedly to follow the instructions given on the Your First Real Singer Voice web page, but have had no luck.
 
I have tried recording my voice from within the Real Singer dialog, and I have tried creating sample files and loading them in in that dialog.  
 
This is what the Real Singer dialog box looks like when I've completed validating all the phonemes:
 
https://1drv.ms/u/s!AmniWT1a0L-5h5l0RmM9TQ35oJGqhw" alt="" border="0">
 
According to the instructions, at this point I should simply press the Close button and when I return to the Virtual Singer dialog box, I should be able to save my voice to the list by pressing on the Add to list button.  When I do that, this is what I see:
 
https://1drv.ms/u/s!AmniWT1a0L-5h5l1amTWjGs5aZw4kQ" alt="" border="0">
 
But, when I press on the Try button, no sound plays.
 
What am I doing wrong?
« Last Edit: Mar 23rd, 2019, 9:44pm by harleygnuya » offline
muddle
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Re: Can't save Real Singer   sample_save_1.jpg
« Reply #1 on: Mar 24th, 2019, 9:58pm »
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Hallo Harley, it's probably possible to help but i am not seeing anything at those links. They are about as blank as my brain can be!    Maybe an image in unusual format?
 
 You can attach jpg files to a post on this forum.
Here is a screenshot of my HA just after I saved a voice by 'adding to list.'
 
The slot with the  (added) orange line across is where you enter a word (or words) for the singer to sing when you hit the try button.  
So, first simple step ... did you put in a word in the slot before hitting the button.    
And is the volume up on your speakers/earphones.
 
will continue when  required .
Would be very interested to hear this voice if you get it working. Any new timbre in a mix is welcome.
 
muddle
« Last Edit: Mar 25th, 2019, 7:12am by muddle » offline


You tube videos using HA or Virtual Singers:- https://www.youtube.com/user/TheMuddleglum/videos
harleygnuya
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  harleygnuya   harleygnuya


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Re: Can't save Real Singer   2019-03-23_14_33_13-Harmony_Assistant.png
« Reply #2 on: Mar 26th, 2019, 1:43am »
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Hi Muddle,
 
Thanks for your response.  I'm going to try attaching my images to this post, but it appears to only allow me one attachment.  Here goes.
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harleygnuya
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  harleygnuya   harleygnuya


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Re: Can't save Real Singer   2019-03-23_14_19_45-Harmony_Assistant.png
« Reply #3 on: Mar 26th, 2019, 2:44am »
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OK, it took the attachment, but it looks like it can take only one per post.  Is that right, or is there a way to attach more than one?
 
At any rate, that was the second of my images from the prior post.
 
I'm attaching the first image to this post.
 
To answer your questions, I did have words in the "Try" edit box, as you'll see in my second image.  And, yes, my speakers were working and the volume was up.  I could hear the standard voices just fine, but not my newly-created voice.
 
Since I seem to be able to attach only one file at a time, I'll stop here and continue in a new post.
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harleygnuya
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  harleygnuya   harleygnuya


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Re: Can't save Real Singer   2019-03-25_20_53_51-Harmony_Assistant.png
« Reply #4 on: Mar 26th, 2019, 2:56am »
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Having tried several times, in different languages, to create a voice, I decided I'd go a different route and went over to the voice editor, so that I could build the voice phoneme-by-phoneme, testing it as each of my recorded phonemes replaced it related standard voice phoneme.  Since I was doing Latin, I chose the word, "Deo" to test my voice.
 
Try-ing it, the editor shows this fragment string: "SQ<DL2>EI>AW".  So, I started with the EI phoneme and recorded it in the editor.  I located EI: French e in the list on the left of the editor.   tbc...
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harleygnuya
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  harleygnuya   harleygnuya


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Re: Can't save Real Singer  
« Reply #5 on: Mar 26th, 2019, 3:22am »
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Using the editor, I recorded EI (Est), then clicked on the Validate button and the EI entry changed from bold to normal text and three dots appeared next to it, which I assume means that it was successfully recorded.  But, when I Try-ed it, I heard the beginning "D" and the trailing "o", but the "e" in the middle did not sound.
 
Repeating this with the other phonemes, I eventually advanced to the point where no sound was being played at all.
 
All of this is consistent with what I experienced trying to build a new voice using the Real Singer: Voice Input dialog box.
 
What frustrates me is that I started using HA in the early 2000's and had no trouble creating Real Singer voices back then.  But, it's been quite a few years since I have used it and now I don't seem to be able to get it to work.
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muddle
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Re: Can't save Real Singer  
« Reply #6 on: Mar 26th, 2019, 6:31am »
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OK , I am sharing your frustration here. It used to be fairly  straight foward to do real voices.
 
This part of the  latest version does not appear to be working properly.  I tried  some basic vowels and they appeared to be captured, but the 'try' button did not seem to produce any sound.
However, this may be  the sample being cut off short in the playback ... presumably there is looping involved  .. and this has  failed
A longer nonsense try word like "aaaiiirr" ( i made an AIR  fragment ) did at least produce a semi sustained noise.
  It becomes hard to tell what is happening.  
 
I was creating this voice on a simple lyrics staff.  
The AIR  phoneme is a single fragment, sound  so i wrote a series of notes  with 'air' as words . The result was series of short "pleep" like  sounds.  No sustain.  
I think something is  astray compared with what I used to experience with making these voices.  
 
I also tried to record new vowels  into some existing real voices.
One voice allowed this, and such a new recorded vowel was accepted.   But other voices  claimed that the fragment "couldn't  be edited in this language".  
 The correct fragments were shown in bold as they always have been before, so  I'm wondering of some voices made in earlier  HA versions have some internal "flag" set differently.
 
My current real voices can be edited by copying  fragments to create more languages, but that's not going to help with a new voice from scratch.
 
I think there will need to be some checking by our programmers to see what's going on.  
 
Possibly earlier HA versions will still work but I'm not sure how far back you would have to go... and there might be compatibility problems.
 
Sorry, I can't help more.
 
David L.
« Last Edit: Mar 26th, 2019, 6:34am by muddle » offline

You tube videos using HA or Virtual Singers:- https://www.youtube.com/user/TheMuddleglum/videos
harleygnuya
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  harleygnuya   harleygnuya


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Re: Can't save Real Singer  
« Reply #7 on: Mar 26th, 2019, 8:01am »
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Don't worry.  The fact that you are experiencing these things, too, is a BIG help.  Maybe not in getting me to the point where I can build my own Real Voice right now, but certainly in verifying that an issue exists and that I'm not the only one having this problem.  Thanks!
 
If I read your response correctly, you seemed to say that at least one of the existing voices you tried did allow you to replace some phonemes.  If that's the case, perhaps I might go looking around for some existing voices and hopefully find one that would allow me to replace its phonemes with mine.  Where are good places to find Real Singer voices?  I'm not having much luck googling them.
 
Also, I have a few earlier versions of HA installation files still, going back to v9.6.3i, which I think is from 2013.  I might try installing one of them on my laptop to see if I can get it to work there.  If so, I'll let you know.
 
Thanks
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muddle
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Re: Can't save Real Singer  
« Reply #8 on: Mar 26th, 2019, 9:28am »
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A last thought.  If it is needed, i could send you the the real singer voice which is , in this HA version, able to record new fragments over the old, and sings a sustained vowel  afterwards.
 
It does english, latin ..   and german, (close enough for my uses.)
You have to have the voice on a staff.
 And be sure the language, when the voice is first  opened  from the staff, is set to the language you want to edit .  
Otherwise setting the language in the open fragment editor seems to be not effective,  you  get the notice that the fragment can't be edited.  
And you would have to set all the parameters of  timbre etc to your new voice,  
 
Augh.. its all a bit much.  But if you need it can be sent somehow.  
 
Good luck.  David L.
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muddle
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Re: Can't save Real Singer  
« Reply #9 on: Mar 26th, 2019, 9:28pm »
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I further checked the voice that appears to accept changes to vowels etc,  correctly when in edit fragment mode.  
This test I was able to load it as an original english language setting, and record new  vowel changes.  It also  changed the fragments correctly when the language was altered in the fragment editing section.  Which was a pleasant surprise, that's how it always used to be.
 
If you modified this voice you may only have to change the vowels,   the consonants may fit reasonably well.  
Some of them have been reverted to the standard VS consonants with a bit of volume adjusting i think.  its very tricky how consonants can seem too loud in some words and too quiet in others.  I think that's also altered by the timbre settings  you use.  
But you will definitely need to alter the timbre , this voice is from a genuine natural rich bass voice.  Maybe set timbre to neutral in a copy of this voice and use that copy when making your own.
 
 
If you would like the voice i will have to attach to an email as it about 2.5 megs , which is too large for a forum attachment.  
To privately get  your email, you could send me the address with an "Instant message"  ... its below the user name .
 
I would delete it directly after sending the attachment.
 
  David L.
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You tube videos using HA or Virtual Singers:- https://www.youtube.com/user/TheMuddleglum/videos
harleygnuya
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  harleygnuya   harleygnuya


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Re: Can't save Real Singer  
« Reply #10 on: Mar 27th, 2019, 12:43am »
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Hi David,
 
Yeah, I was thinking about the instant message, too.  We might have to try that, but I'm working another option right now, so let me see if what I'm doing works out, and if it does, I won't need to bother you for your file.
 
As I mentioned, I have several older versions of HA (I always archive my old installation images when I download an update).  So, I installed v9.7.1c onto my laptop and tried to create a portion of a Latin voice, and I was able to generate my "Deo" and even tested it in a simple one-staff file with notes of different duration and pitch.  It played perfectly on my laptop.
 
---------------
 
I've now taken it over to my workstation and it shows up in my voices and I can play it in a simple file.  Yay!
 
Unfortunately, I can't edit it in v9.8.1e on my workstation.  It exhibits the same behavior; that is, it does not produce noticeable sound.  I even tried on my workstation to replace one of the Real Singer phonemes I recorded on my laptop (v9.7.1c), but all it did was to make that phoneme go silent.
 
So, I've got a workaround, but I think it's pretty clear that someone at Myriad needs to take a look at this to see why v9.8.1e is acting this way.  How do we let them know?  Should I go ahead and submit a trouble ticket to Support?
 
In the meantime, I'm going to go ahead and create a full US English voice on my laptop and see how it plays on my workstation.  I'll let you know how it goes.
 
Thanks for your help on this.
 
-Ken
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muddle
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Re: Can't save Real Singer  
« Reply #11 on: Mar 27th, 2019, 3:48am »
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Glad you made progress Ken. One can just send an email to one of the team.  I'm never sure which one to go to.  I usually try the windows expert ...  
...  olivier@myriad-online.com  
 
The more exact  your description the better the chance they will  realize what's going on and provide advice or correction.  They may have already read these posts and are sorting it out.  
 
David.
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You tube videos using HA or Virtual Singers:- https://www.youtube.com/user/TheMuddleglum/videos
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